Deepsinking.org?

[dk_angel7]

I first found this interest group around 1997 or so when it was on pacifier.com.

The history (from my understanding) is as I list it.

Late 90's pacifier.com contained the entire WAM interest as a whole. There were three segments. However, the 'wet' and 'messy' group allied with the quicksanders united to aggressively expel those who preferred both kinds of human excrement to get messy. This went so far as to deny that the latter folk were any part of the WAM interest. Soon afterwards there was no evidence that the group ever had any affiliation with the mud/food messies and the quicksanders.

Aug 12, 1999 saw the founding of deep_sinking@yahoogroups.com solidified the split between the messy mud/fooders and the quicksanders. The messies were stuck on the yahoo groups wamfanmail and wamforum, which quickly fell into the control of just one person. I believe that one or both still exist but they went dead about ten years ago. So ended whatever single source of community the messies had.

Early 2009 saw the implosion of deepsinking.org. This forum went straight to the sex fetish aspect. This event left behind the strictly melodramatic element of the interest. Writers and artists who’s work included children were hardly heard from again; qs-pencil, toby o’keefe, and myself. Others, including Dr. Yen, Quickmoose, and Sigmond Fraud would not be heard from again, if ever. Even Foster Blake no longer posts as much as he used to.

I believed (and still do) that there was a large silent group who just sat back and lurked who was strictly melodramatics. This is the group that was left behind with the recent evolution of the interest.

As a member of this group, I saw this change with great regret and in a negative light.

Despite my years of denial, I saw it coming. It was unstoppable. The evolution has occurred and the strictly melodramatic segment is the next group to be left behind.

The melodramatics are still out there. But we are still standing on the pear on an empty dock still waving as the new boat sails into the horizon.

I give you folks my best wishes as we walk back to what is left of our old empty abandoned boat permanently tied to its moorings.

[Fred588]

While I became involved in this community around 1998 I never heard of pacifier.com and so cannot comment about that part of your history. I will say, however, that you have a few facts wrong or incomplete. For example, three of the four individuals mentioned are still around, though some have new names. You mention two early groups and imply that their "control by just one person" led to their demise, but their demise was a lot more due to an evolution of technology. These were simple list servers and the forum format is clearly a better one. As for this forum being devoted to the "sex fetish aspect" I see no evidence of this. Recognizing that there IS a sex-fetish aspect is very different from being limited to that. I don't believe there is anything in this forum's rules or history to indicate lack, or even diminuation, of interest in the melodramatic.

I first found this interest group around 1997 or so when it was on pacifier.com.

The history (from my understanding) is as I list it.

Late 90's pacifier.com contained the entire WAM interest as a whole. There were three segments. However, the 'wet' and 'messy' group allied with the quicksanders united to aggressively expel those who preferred both kinds of human excrement to get messy. This went so far as to deny that the latter folk were any part of the WAM interest. Soon afterwards there was no evidence that the group ever had any affiliation with the mud/food messies and the quicksanders.

Aug 12, 1999 saw the founding of deep_sinking@yahoogroups.com solidified the split between the messy mud/fooders and the quicksanders. The messies were stuck on the yahoo groups wamfanmail and wamforum, which quickly fell into the control of just one person. I believe that one or both still exist but they went dead about ten years ago. So ended whatever single source of community the messies had.

Early 2009 saw the implosion of deepsinking.org. This forum went straight to the sex fetish aspect. This event left behind the strictly melodramatic element of the interest. Writers and artists who’s work included children were hardly heard from again; qs-pencil, toby o’keefe, and myself. Others, including Dr. Yen, Quickmoose, and Sigmond Fraud would not be heard from again, if ever. Even Foster Blake no longer posts as much as he used to.

I believed (and still do) that there was a large silent group who just sat back and lurked who was strictly melodramatics. This is the group that was left behind with the recent evolution of the interest.

As a member of this group, I saw this change with great regret and in a negative light.

Despite my years of denial, I saw it coming. It was unstoppable. The evolution has occurred and the strictly melodramatic segment is the next group to be left behind.

The melodramatics are still out there. But we are still standing on the pear on an empty dock still waving as the new boat sails into the horizon.

I give you folks my best wishes as we walk back to what is left of our old empty abandoned boat permanently tied to its moorings.

[Duncan Edwards]

While I became involved in this community around 1998 I never heard of pacifier.com and so cannot comment about that part of your history. I will say, however, that you have a few facts wrong or incomplete. For example, three of the four individuals mentioned are still around, though some have new names. You mention two early groups and imply that their "control by just one person" led to their demise, but their demise was a lot more due to an evolution of technology. These were simple list servers and the forum format is clearly a better one. As for this forum being devoted to the "sex fetish aspect" I see no evidence of this. Recognizing that there IS a sex-fetish aspect is very different from being limited to that. I don't believe there is anything in this forum's rules or history to indicate lack, or even diminuation, of interest in the melodramatic.

Agreed.

There is nothing limiting melodrama here in any fashion. There is also no limit placed on recognizing our fetish interest has a sexual dimension as well. Attempting to place a limit on the erotic aspects of a sexual fetish is what led to the mass exodus from deepsinking.org to QSF.

[PM2K]

Attempting to place a limit on the erotic aspects of a sexual fetish is what led to the mass exodus from deepsinking.org to QSF.

Agreed, although it was unfortunate... I remember the time of this situation leading to the split unfolding and around that time I received a nastygram from one of the monitors at DS over some of my fakes... and issues of concern with the anime subjects I was choosing to use.

Now, to be fair, I always see these boards as subject to those running them, and if monitors have issues, then that's fine. It is ultimately their playground, and I'll follow the rules. No problem.

I think the split was inevitable... as the community grew, so did certain aspects of it, including those who see mud/qs as all about eroticism, and those who thought it should all be melodramatic peril. The majority of us fall between the two, I believe, but with greater numbers came bigger camps on each side, and eventually there would be those who felt uncomfortable being with the other faction.

I chalk it up to just part of the evolution of the qs community, and wish all sides well.

[Duncan Edwards]

... as the community grew, so did certain aspects of it, including those who see mud/qs as all about eroticism, and those who thought it should all be melodramatic peril. The majority of us fall between the two...

I chalk it up to just part of the evolution of the qs community, and wish all sides well.

I think that expresses the whole thing perfectly. It's certainly how the people behind this board feel.

[Nessie]

Actually, messies have a thriving and healthy community. They all ended up at UMD.net. The administrator of UMD accepts quicksand as part of WAM and as far as he's concerned, us quicksand folk are welcome to have all the quicksand clips we like in our UMD clip stores, but the melodramatic/peril aspect of quicksand does put many messy-only fans off. If you have grim endings, be prepared to read responses from people who simply cannot understand.

Absolutely no, and I do mean none, excrement WAM is allowed at UMD. They will lock the thread lickety-split if you try.

I'm not sure where UMD came from exactly although they talk about Rob Blaine as an important part of their heritage.

I recently opened an account at Fetlife. Human excrement fetish is allowed there.

Ya know what? I try very hard not to judge others on their turn-ons, and I don't actually have a moral problem with poop, as in, I don't think loving it is a sin or a scandal or "just plain wrong" or anything like that...it's just that there are things that need to be in one room, while other things should be in other rooms -- with walls and doors with truth-in-packaging signs tacked to the outsides.

And if everybody can respect the signs and agree not to go into rooms where there are things inside that they already KNOW that they can't handle, we will all get along a lot better.

Nessie

[Aiko]

The majority of us fall between the two,..

Actually I only just realized that several of my stories touch both the melodramatic and the erotic side with characters sometimes having a hard time to decide which way to go. I am glad QSF accepts both aspects, otherwise those stories would not be suitable for this board nor for DS.

Like some others I still visit the "old place" occasionally. I would not have expected it to survive to this day when the exodus came, but then the costs to operate it must have gone down along with the activity there. It is kind of a sad sight these days though for someone who has seen it at its peak.

I recently opened an account at Fetlife. Human excrement fetish is allowed there.

I can understand why the excrement folks had to split off first. While I would not much mind sharing with other WAM interests, this particular fetish could easily turn a message board into a sort of minefield for me with threads I would very much like to avoid. I don't mean to sound intolerant, but I just can't help feeling disgusted at some things.

Let them have their own little corner of the internet over at Fetlife with their own healthy community. Don't expect me to ever visit there though.

[dk_angel7]

I preface that this is from my observation from my position. There are parts of our history I may not be aware of due to my noninvolvement, denial, or just plain density of my marshmallow like brain.

While I became involved in this community around 1998 I never heard of pacifier.com and so cannot comment about that part of your history.

The community moved from ‘pacifier.com’ to Onelist in 1998 or so. Onelist merged into ‘eGroups’ in November of 1999. Yahoo purchased ‘eGroups’ in June 2000. That is how we ended up in Yahoo Groups.

You mention two early groups and imply that their "control by just one person" led to their demise, but their demise was a lot more due to an evolution of technology. These were simple list servers and the forum format is clearly a better one.

I saw dominant control of one individual was just one of may possible symptoms that it was going down. I agree that technological evolution was very primary to the history.

Yet the creation of Deep_Sinking@yahoogroups.com went a long way to create a ‘narrower category of the WAM (Wet And Messy) interest, and a broader category of the Quicksand interest.’ It was clearly ‘open to all genders and orientations’ with no intention to ban a group of people other than to ‘be at or above the age of majority for the community in which you live.’

As it happened, the quicksanders made their home at Deep Sinking. Wamforum and Wamfanmail predominately became home to the messys. The split became much more pronounced.

Actually, messies have a thriving and healthy community. They all ended up at UMD.net.

Sorry, I was not aware that they continued to evolve and found a new home.

As for this forum being devoted to the "sex fetish aspect" I see no evidence of this. Recognizing that there IS a sex-fetish aspect is very different from being limited to that. I don't believe there is anything in this forum's rules or history to indicate lack, or even diminuation, of interest in the melodramatic.

Agreed. There is no attempt to ban the melodramatic aspect of this interest.

Attempting to place a limit on the erotic aspects of a sexual fetish is what led to the mass exodus from deepsinking.org to QSF.

Agreed. Thus those who made the exodus were those (in the strong majority) who were into the ‘erotic aspects of the sex fetish’. I parallel this to the creation of Deep_Sinking@yahoogroups.com and the exodus of the quicsanders to that site from Wamforum and Wanfanmail. The bulk of the messys were left back in those two groups.

We really didn’t see anyone posting anything about ‘messy’ stuff at DS@YG. From my observation, there is little to no strickly melodramatic stuff at QSF. Not that this was intentional. It was just the nature of the evolution.

Agreed, although it was unfortunate... I remember the time of this situation leading to the split unfolding and around that time I received a nastygram from one of the monitors at DS over some of my fakes... and issues of concern with the anime subjects I was choosing to use.

Oh! Oh! Let me guess! Jiminy Thicket! Could say more but won’t.

I think the split was inevitable... as the community grew, so did certain aspects of it, including those who see mud/qs as all about eroticism, and those who thought it should all be melodramatic peril. The majority of us fall between the two, I believe, but with greater numbers came bigger camps on each side, and eventually there would be those who felt uncomfortable being with the other faction.

I chalk it up to just part of the evolution of the QS community, and wish all sides well.

I don’t know about “should all be melodramatic peril” but I did see a great discord between strictly melodramatics, which included the underage and the powerful presence of the fetish aspect.

I don’t know what motivated the removal of the erotic aspect from DS. But they were sure left behind as a result.

Epilogue

I now wait upon Pele (the Hawaiian god of lighting, thunder, and lava) to rain his fiery wrath upon me in response to my posting.

Just kidding.

[Duncan Edwards]

I now wait upon Pele (the Hawaiian god of lighting, thunder, and lava) to rain his fiery wrath upon me in response to my posting.

Just kidding.

You didn't say anything that wasn't opinion or generally inaccurate so I think you're safe.

One thing we do appear to have left behind is a great tradition (myself included) of snarkiness, abuse, and mob moderation. Dave set this particular "ethical environment" early on and it's been easy to maintain.

[Jinn]

I don't really have an opinion. I'm just thankful that many people over the years have put effort towards facilitating this area of interest, like Kaol, Mick Sand, the people over at deepsinking.org and of course the crew at this forum and the countless contributors and producers.

I didn't get any farther on 'Sinking Island' at deepsinking than the patio. Compared to some of the visual and tangible outlets like Second Life, 'Sinking Island' never had the appeal. Nevertheless it was a great place to pound back virtual booze and shoot the breeze with like-minded sinkheads, in real time.